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  #11  
Old 08-02-2015, 04:21 PM
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Gary
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

What don't you like about the temperament of a goss.



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Originally Posted by Deathgrip View Post
what makes you both say it would ruin a gos or the hh ?

why wouldnt you get best of both worlds speed and gameness of the gos
temperament of the hh

as i say i am new to the falconry side of hunting
and know that some crosses out perform pure breds hands down
in the field


cheers

Doug
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  #12  
Old 08-02-2015, 04:57 PM
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Billy Mazella
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

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I always thought the Harris had the initial speed but the Red Tail has the endurance?
In my experience Red tails are quicker than HH's

A HH's endurance with the correct training can match that of a red tail!
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  #13  
Old 08-02-2015, 05:07 PM
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Sam
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

Well you learn something new everyday.
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  #14  
Old 08-02-2015, 06:12 PM
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Thumbs up Re: Harris X goss hybrid

It has been tried Doug. The results were not good. Hawks developing sight issues. I spoke to someone that flew one of these (A Maltese chap). He said that it was worse than the worst Gos he has flown and equally worse than a Harris! He said the temprement was not that of a Gos nor a HH it was inbetween the two which was not ideal .... It was a twittering wreck. What we must try to remember is that if you want something between a HH and a Goshawk then Mother Nature has already put something in place for you... The Redtail is a perfect inbetweener! Can be as aggressive as any Gos, is faster than a Harris etc etc.....

Better results were seen with the Buzzard X Goshawk at least in the 'health' sense. Heaven knows why anyone would want to do that though!

Regards,

Bill

Thanks Bill

i know what you mean with the redtail but sorry to say i just dont like the bird dont know why and ive seen so very good ones hunt but its just a no for me with them

i have found a lot more info on the cross or should i say ppl that have tried to cross the hh & goss but the gene pools just dont mix 99% die before they reach a couple of weeks old so that itself tells me its a no go
have to have a rethink

one again cheers for the input
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  #15  
Old 08-02-2015, 06:27 PM
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

What don't you like about the temperament of a goss.

Hi Gary
the thing i have seen with the goss is they can be temperamental
which i think could get more hassle then the birds worth
but not come across an imprint yet
but hear they can be screamers

as where the cast i hunt are silent not a sound they dont even fidgit on the fist while waiting for the action to start

if i was to see this in a good working goss then i could be tempted
maybe lol but i must admit i do like their speed and their gameness

Cheers

Doug
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  #16  
Old 08-02-2015, 07:02 PM
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Billy Mazella
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

Doug,

It's like with everything.... The bird will only be as good as you make it! Whatever that bird may be.

A good PR Gos or a Imprint done right will be bullet proof! - If you want a nice steady Goshawk with a good temprement go for a renowned breeder of Goshawks and go for a Finnish bird!

My money (when I have any) will go Derbyshire Goshawks way! Best female Gos I have ever Trained, entered and flew!

My advice would be whatever you do... Go all in! No deals or messing about just save up and pay for something decent from the get go! You can't go wrong!
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  #17  
Old 08-02-2015, 07:15 PM
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

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Originally Posted by SoldierHawker View Post
Doug,

It's like with everything.... The bird will only be as good as you make it! Whatever that bird may be.

A good PR Gos or a Imprint done right will be bullet proof! - If you want a nice steady Goshawk with a good temprement go for a renowned breeder of Goshawks and go for a Finnish bird!

My money (when I have any) will go Derbyshire Goshawks way! Best female Gos I have ever Trained, entered and flew!

My advice would be whatever you do... Go all in! No deals or messing about just save up and pay for something decent from the get go! You can't go wrong!
Hi Billy
i understand what you mean you get what you pay for i was the same when i worked the running dogs i only bought pups or bred them from the very best available

so why the finnish blood lines what do they offer above the others ?

Cheers

Doug
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  #18  
Old 08-02-2015, 07:53 PM
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Billy Mazella
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

Most Finnish Hawks are renowned for being steadier than their German/Czech counterparts.

I used Finnish as an example because there are plenty about and they're certainly steadier! Especially as youngsters (I find).

Mick Kane
Margeresons
Jim Smith (Goldie on here)


Some top breeders with top stock. Like with the dog world, I imagine, there are plenty of messers in the falconry world that will sell you everything you want (til you open the tin!)

Pay good money (not too much) for the right bird from the right person and you cannot go wrong!
I cannot imagine why anyone would want an 'inbetweener', a Harris Hawk is for the easy going, steady paced falconer (me now) and a Goshawk is for some one wanting to take game consecutively and in quick succession! Longer slips, fast flights, more stomping about the field (me before). I would only reccomend a Goshawk if you have the time in which to fly one! A HarrisHawk may well settle for the weekly trip out or every few days... A Goshawks requires a whole lot more commitment.

I don't think, if you have time, that you would go far wrong with a nice Finnish male/female! There are other subspecies on the market... White this, White that, albidusXSiberian this and that malarkey but you'd be better to stick to a nice Finnish bird from an honest breeder!

Finnish are steadier, a little larger and generally the Males don't leave much to ransom!
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  #19  
Old 08-02-2015, 10:20 PM
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

That is also one of my concerns do i have the time for a goss

like you say i can get away with not hunting my hh,s every day all tho i do try to get them to do some flying/training one way or another
would this be enough for a goss to have a session high jump ups and some lure training on the days i cant get out and hunt

this is why the interest came around about the hybrid and having the best of both worlds like this week not had the chance to get out hunting but done plenty of fitness training but got out this morning took a crow and a couple of bunnys all from the fist would a goss cope with this sort of life ?


Cheers

Doug
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  #20  
Old 08-02-2015, 11:19 PM
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Billy Mazella
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Default Re: Harris X goss hybrid

Goshawks are very highly strung and once killing they wd to be hunted hard or boredom and bad habits soon set in! I would say that you could get away with it but only with a matured hawk! A young adolescent Goshawk needs to be flown hard in its first 2-3 seasons of it is to make a good solid hawk!

Ask about people's opinions will vary but that's my opinion based on my experience.

The cross is floored like you said most young do die young and those getting to the entering stage only dispoint.

If your happy with your HH then why change at all? Perhaps that's something to consider?

ATB Bill
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