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  #51  
Old 19-07-2010, 03:08 PM
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Fielde243 Fielde243 is offline
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

Looking forward to how this hybrid preforms in the field, got a feeling it will be something special... how can it not!?

forget calling it a harris eagle or golden hawk... i think superior harris has never been more fitting , cheers Ed
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  #52  
Old 19-07-2010, 06:12 PM
Goshawk007 Goshawk007 is offline
Simon Etherington
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by AdeyHawk1970 View Post
What is the problem with the harris/ferug hybrid when hunting?Is it quarry or habitat relatedI think a redtail(harlans)/goldie would also be an interesting hybrid for you to try
Interesting comment. Find me someone who actually flew them on game for an extended time. I have read a few articles in the past. The articles never dealt with the birds being flown hard. It seemed to be more about beginner training, not actual falconry.
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  #53  
Old 19-07-2010, 06:58 PM
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CuCulaine CuCulaine is offline
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by goshawk007 View Post
Interesting comment. Find me someone who actually flew them on game for an extended time. I have read a few articles in the past. The articles never dealt with the birds being flown hard. It seemed to be more about beginner training, not actual falconry.
No problem contact Floyd Presly, Frostburg Maryland USA, cheers.
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  #54  
Old 19-07-2010, 08:19 PM
Goshawk007 Goshawk007 is offline
Simon Etherington
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

Ok, where's the article???
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  #55  
Old 19-07-2010, 08:57 PM
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

Guesses.....
I think that hawk is gone have a tail longer than a goldie shorter wing span ( proportionaly of course) more muscular power than a harris , heavier and faster with better penetration into cover than a harris
will be more manoeuvrable than a goldie but not as muchas a harris
Grip will definitely an improvement over harris and more than enough for any prey .
It's gone be also more capable of attacking again than a goldie after a miss ( good improvement )
Definitively more agressive than a harris that can be a drawback , I'm not convince that a jack russell would be out of reach )
Weight control would also be interesting to see how would it work more along eagle or harris line?
Weather proof would certainly be an improvement .
Ferru goldie doesn't seem so attractive as being from same shape it isn't really breaking new grounds as this one
Now the absolute terminator ... for that kind of size would be a gos x goldie but that would be probably close to training a cougar or leopard ....
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  #56  
Old 19-07-2010, 09:47 PM
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CuCulaine CuCulaine is offline
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by goshawk007 View Post
ok, where's the article???
Ask NAFA for that edition.
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  #57  
Old 19-07-2010, 10:40 PM
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by CuCulaine View Post
Guys my simple 2cents on this issue is as follows:
Its just short of a miracle, I'd love to fly this bird, if I could but the person flying this bird I can assure you is one of the best game hawkers I know, so no issue of handling etc. The bird will be in excellant hands this fall, but I think we will need 3-4 yrs before we really know its capabilities. I know the breeders very well can can assure you that the almighty dollar wasnt even in their thoughts when they made this hybrid.

In Ontario we have hare (European released in the 50's and hybrids between them and white tailed jacks that were left) yes, intentional hybrid jacks. Early in the season Harris hawks, Redtails, Ferruginous and Golds can take them consistantly, while mid season to late season they cant. The female Golds can, heard of a male Gold that was stunned by a Jack, thought it was dead. Great Horned Owls might take them not sure but after this its dogs, Fox's and Cyotes.

We have Geese, Canada's & Snows, Wild Turkies, various birds as well, as for hunting white tailed deer bring a Harpy. The terrain is such, that with game issues and with the tempature range we have nothing out side of Golds that will (though very rare) can consistantly take this game.

In Ontario the paper nightmare to hunt a full Gold is mind staggering, then to locating suffcient game is another issue, lets not talk about wild life protection groups, Humane societies or local exoctic animal bylaws. God help us here if the a Goldie hits someones dog, horse or other, the pit bull terrier issues again. While hybrids will avoid alot of this as they are man made.

Funny how people think of hybrids, back an eon ago if people felt this way then there would be no breeds of dogs, cats, horses, cows etc, they were selectivily bred & hybridized for traits that humans found usefull, that we are using today.

These animals have not exterminated any pure species in the wild that I am aware of. Remember too that natural hybridization in the wild usually creates a more successfull one in the environment, that with a changing enviornment the natural species cant sustain itself, everything in nature changes continually, trial & error, adapt or be replaced, die out.

According to our game department here, a wild native species will forever remain a wild species no matter how many generations have been bred in captivity, there are no domestic raptors. If these people ruled an eon ago we would never have had any domestic animals. While the same ageny refuses to acknowledge any impact on native species due to ferral cats for fear of public out cry, if a negative solution was initiated, while its legal to shoot dogs found in the wilds.

This hybrid in eastern Canada could fill a niche that isnt filled here now, I'll go out on the limb and say its the hawk of the future.
Besides the fact that there are people who always opposed to hybrids (and that is a respect and interesting discussion in itself), this is one of the most substantive arguments I've read so far.
Class!
I am very curious what the hybrid will do in the future anyway; if I would have preferred a hybrid in this field, for me it would be the RTxGE...
(Brings a separate discussion: intelligence RT/HH)

Regards, Arnoud
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  #58  
Old 20-07-2010, 06:23 AM
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AdeyHawk1970 AdeyHawk1970 is offline
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by CuCulaine View Post
Its the terain as I understand it, it doesnt handle cover or woodlots very good, unlike Harris's and Redtails both of which out performed it on cotton tails and squirrels.
This is the answer i was expecting as the ferrugi cant fly in enclosed land at all.Thr goldie handle woodland better than the ferrugi and its a better bird.Perhaps the ferrugi/harris would do better in more open ground
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  #59  
Old 20-07-2010, 12:17 PM
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

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Originally Posted by goshawk007 View Post
ok, where's the article???
Simon I have the article . The bird, the first ever was bred by my friend and falconry mentor Colin Trefry. The birds name was Gusto.
If I can find it I will scan and post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdeyHawk1970 View Post
This is the answer i was expecting as the ferrugi cant fly in enclosed land at all.Thr goldie handle woodland better than the ferrugi and its a better bird.Perhaps the ferrugi/harris would do better in more open ground
I have flown two ferrug x redtail hybrids and not one of them had the speed of my male bald eagle, who was flown in wide open country and treed areas. It wasn't even close.
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  #60  
Old 20-07-2010, 01:33 PM
Goshawk007 Goshawk007 is offline
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Default Re: Harris X Goldie

I thought you guys would like this picture. As you can see the young one is quite a bit smaller then the mother eagle who is a little closer and sitting higher on the edge of the nest, but is still at least 3 times the size of the baby. The young bird is 30 days old.
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